TRANSCRIPT – Sunday Agenda, Sky News

Angie Bell MP

Shadow Minister for the Environment

Shadow Minister for Youth

Federal Member for Moncrieff

TRANSCRIPT

Sunday Agenda, Sky News

2 November 2025

Subjects: Climate policy; Net Zero; Labor’s failure to deliver cheaper energy; Labor’s rush to pass unworkable environmental laws, Ambassador Rudd; Joy Division.

E&OE…………………………………………………………………………………………………

ANDREW CLENNELL:

Joining me live now is Shadow Environment Minister Angie Bell. Thanks for your time Angie Bell. Let’s start with what’s about to happen in terms of the Coalition’s stance on climate policy. What do you make of the National Party document I just revealed recommending dumping net zero and making prices the priority and only reducing emissions at the speed of comparable nations? What do you think of that proposal?

ANGIE BELL:

Well, I certainly think the most important thing for Australians is energy prices. And I just heard Sam Rae that, you know, he’s putting downward pressure on energy prices. I mean, can Sam Rae go back and just explain that to the Australian people who now know, categorically, that renewables are not the cheapest form of energy when they’re paying so much for their energy bills, Andrew. In terms of the National Party, well, they have their processes and we’re going through our processes as you know, and we’ll come to our position on energy and emissions policy in due course.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

And from what you’re saying, it sounds like you’ll be with them on prices is the number one thing. Prices over emissions in terms of priority.

ANGIE BELL:

Well, I don’t think they’re mutually exclusive necessarily, but we know that the Labor Party has categorically failed when it comes to delivering cheaper energy for Australians. We’ve got smelters going out of business, we’ve got manufacturing jobs that we’re losing. I mean, the country is an economic mess thanks to this government and their reckless rollout of their energy policy, Andrew. Enough’s, enough.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

We say it’s an economic mess. We’ve got unemployment under five per cent. We’ve got growth. We’ve got inflation has ticked up to 3 per cent, but it was 2.5 per cent. And they won 94 seats. So how do you explain all that?

ANGIE BELL:

Okay, so here’s a big credit card and Australians are paying $50,000 a minute in interest alone, which is really very unfair when it comes to the next generation having to pick up that bill. Inflation has ticked up and so there’s the warning bells right there. The government needs to stop spending and stop spending now, Andrew.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

I just reported we could get to a situation where the Coalition has an aspiration around emissions reduction rather than a target. Do you think that’s a possibility?

ANGIE BELL:

Look, I know, Andrew, that you and your viewers would love me to tell you where the Coalition is exactly right now on energy policy. I’m not going to do that today because we’ve been through a process. We’re going through a process. We’ll come to that in due course. On Friday, we had another meeting of the backbench and I was present at that meeting, and we all agreed that energy prices need to come down and that we need to do our part in global emissions. Now I don’t want to get ahead of that in respect for my colleagues. Dan Tehan is running that show and so I will leave that announcement of our policy to Dan and Sussan.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

Do you think we’ll get an announcement this week?

ANGIE BELL:

Again, this is speculation. Obviously, Dan said there would be a process that would take six to nine months. I think we’re around about month six. And so, I’m sure that in the coming weeks or months we will see what our position is. But we’re not in a hurry on this. This is a target for 2050, Andrew. We need to go through our proper processes to make sure that we’re right on this because, clearly, the Labor government is failing when it comes to energy prices I mean Albanese got elected on a promise of $275. We’re still waiting for that. I mean, you know, there are people around the country who are choosing between what they feed their children and paying their power bills.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

Could the Coalition resolve to abandon the Paris Agreement?

ANGIE BELL:

Again, that is part of our policy we will work through ,in this process that we’re undertaking at the moment. And we’re not quite at the end of that process.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

So that’s possible.

ANGIE BELL:

Look, the Nats came out early on The Voice. And, you know, we took some months after that. Peter Dutton considered that very carefully in terms of our policy.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

But you’re not ruling that out.

ANGIE BELL:

So, this is not unusual for the Nats.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

You’re not ruling out…

ANGIE BELL:

Not ruling what out, Andrew?

ANDREW CLENNELL:

Abandoning the Paris Agreement.

ANGIE BELL:

I’m not ruling anything out at this point in time because what we need to be is united on one page when it comes to moving forward with our energy policy. And Sussan Ley has said she wants an affordable, reliable grid and she wants to make sure we do our part in global emissions but not at any cost.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

You mentioned the Nats coming out first on The Voice. It does feel like the tail wagging the dog a little bit again, I must admit.

ANGIE BELL:

Look, I think the media love to use that term, the tail wagging the dog. Andrew, we’re not beholden to the National Party, we are the Liberal Party. I sit in the Liberal Party room in Canberra and we’ll go through our processes, which your viewers would understand would be different to the National Party processes. And we’ll come to that in due course when we’ve done the work and when we understand where our policy needs to be.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

How important will it be though when you come to a decision on the Liberal Party policy on this to ensure you’re not splitting the Coalition?

ANGIE BELL:

Well again, I think you’re getting ahead of where we’re up to at the moment. The National Party have their processes, the Liberal Party have our processes. They are different processes. They are different MPs undertaking those processes. And what I will say is we are going through a very thorough investigation of gas, of nuclear, of coal, of all of the inputs into the energy grid to make sure that Australians can pay less.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

Angie Bell, you say I’m getting ahead of myself. In about two and a bit hours’ time, I reckon David Littleproud, the Nationals leader, is going to get up and say he’s abandoning net zero. And I’m told that 20 of your MPs want to keep a net zero target. So, I might be two hours ahead of myself, but I don’t think I’m much further than that. This basically presents you with a dilemma, doesn’t it? Because if their position is dump net zero and you don’t adopt that and 20 of your MPs don’t want that to occur, you are splitting as a Coalition, aren’t you?

ANGIE BELL:

Again, you’re getting ahead of yourself, because we need to go through our processes and we will come to our decision in due course. Now, I’m not going to say what that position is or isn’t and I’m not going to say which colleagues have had their voice, in a room full of MPs, where it was supposed to be MPs talking to MPs about what the best way forward is for our party and for our country. Now, we agreed on a lot of things in that room, Andrew. I was there listening to all of my colleagues and all of their concerns, as well as Dan and others in the room who are on the Energy and Emissions Policy Committee. We will come to our position in due course, and Dan Tehan is heading that up.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

Will the words net zero…

ANGIE BELL:

Keep trying. I’m just going to give you the same answer. I’m going to give you the same answer, Andrew.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

Alright, well fair enough. Let’s move on then. Do you accept the Government argument that it’s not renewables that are causing bills to rise but ailing coal-fired power stations breaking down?

ANGIE BELL:

Well, if you look at the power bill prices in Queensland versus South Australia, my dear old dad lives in South Australia and he’s about 100 per cent renewables, and he’s paying ridiculously high electricity prices. In fact, the highest in the country in South Australia which is 100 per cent renewables, apart from the time when they get power from interstate in Victoria. And in Queensland, where 65 per cent of the grid is from coal-fired power, that’s where the cheapest bills are. So, the proof’s in the pudding. Australians want lower power prices. We need to have reliable power when it comes to our manufacturing, when it comes to industry.

Now, I thought I was coming on your show, Andrew, to talk about EPBC reform, which is before the House this week, I’ll be talking to it on Tuesday. We have some grave concerns around the EPBC Act that the Minister is putting forward, the reforms. It’s got holes in it everywhere. We went into good faith negotiations with the government, but now that we’ve seen the 1,500 pages of legislation that they’re putting before the House, these changes, no stakeholders are happy. We’re worried about jobs. We’re worried about investment. And we’re certainly very worried about productivity, which this government’s supposed to be worried about at the moment. Not to forget the critical minerals deal.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

Can I just say that, well, hang on. I’ll just say you’re getting ahead of yourself now because that was my very next question.

ANGIE BELL:

I’m just worried you’re going to cut me short.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

You never get cut short on this show. Now, the Government is pressuring you to pass these reforms. They’re going to argue that they will get quicker approval and without them the critical minerals deal with the US will be at risk. So, what do you say to that and what are your main sticking points?

ANGIE BELL:

Well, there are a number of sticking points. Let me list them. Shall I show you the many ways of the Labor Party’s failures, Andrew? I think certainly, the Graeme Samuel Review outlined a commissioner to be in charge of this policy area, not a great big EPA with more bureaucratic red tape, and a CEO that’s not accountable to the Minister. That is the first problem that we see, a flaw in this bill. A second is emission reporting, which is currently under the safeguard mechanism in Dan Tehan’s portfolio. In Chris Bowen’s portfolio – God help us. Is under the safeguard mechanism, that’s where it should stay in our view because this is more red and green tape for business, for productivity, for jobs, for industry. We need to make sure that we keep the government honest when it comes to these things if that’s possible at all. But certainly, highlighting those things is what I’ll be doing in the House.

The other thing is around the definition of unacceptable impacts and the definition of net gain. Now, these are broad terms. There are many other broad terms in the bill as well that we’re concerned with, but certainly unacceptable impacts. There are pages around that, but what we want to see is that taken out of the legislation, put into a national standard, so it can come up to best practice as well. So, there’s a lot of things, Andrew, that I’ll be talking about on Tuesday when I get to speak to the second reading of this speech.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

And what’s also been discussed is that it has higher financial penalties than the Plibersek proposals. Are you seeking to get them amended?

ANGIE BELL:

Well, that’s something we’re talking through with industry. The highest penalty is $825 million, which if you’re running industry and jobs and mining and resources, that’s quite a big cut to the bottom line if you accidentally do make some damage in the environment. It doesn’t actually say whether it’s accidental or on purpose, that sort of thing. It’s open to obviously judgement as well as in the courts. So, there are some problems around that. We’re working through that with industry and with stakeholders because as I said there’s 1500 pages in it. Now it’s going to a Senate Inquiry and that’s reporting back at the end of March so we want to make sure that all the stakeholders get their say and Australians can see how this could put a handbrake on productivity, jobs and investment in our country. Which is so important because that’s what delivers infrastructure, hospitals, education. That’s where governments get their money. We know that. But I think it’s important also that young people, in particular, as the Shadow Minister for Youth, understand where their wealth has come from.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

Murray, what reckons he can get this legislation through this year? What do you reckon?

ANGIE BELL:

Well, he’s ramming it through the parliament. I mean, at the beginning of the term he said he was going to take 12 to 18 months to get this legislation and this reform across the line. And now suddenly there’s a dash to the finish line in the next two weeks in Parliament. So why is he rushing it through? Well, because it’s got so many holes in it, Andrew. And so, what we want to do is make sure that we understand what the holes are. If there’s a way through, then obviously we’ll work on amendments that see that way through. If the legislation remains the way it is, we can’t agree to it.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

Just briefly, Angie Bell, nearly out of time. Sussan Ley’s had a couple of difficulties the last week or so. First, there was a call to get rid of Ambassador Rudd, which many thought was rushed. Then there was her request for an apology from the PM for wearing a Joy Division t-shirt off a plane, which not many colleagues backed. Where do you stand on these issues? And are you surprised to see few colleagues backing Sussan Ley on some of these issues?

ANGIE BELL:

Well, certainly, I think I said on the show, Paul Murray’s show, actually, Rudd the Dud, I’ll say it again on your show. I mean, you know, he didn’t have a very good relationship with the US President when you compare it to, say, Joe Hockey or Arthur Sinodinos, who had fantastic relationships with the United States administration. That’s the number one point that I will say.

Number two, with the t-shirt saga, I think the Prime Minister is quaffed every morning. There’s no way that he would have stumbled out of bed and put on a t-shirt backwards that outlined or symbolised what he was wearing. And so, I’ll just say that I think it’s disgraceful that what that band actually signifies, and I’ll say it to your viewers, was you know rape and murder of women during the Holocaust in internment camps. I mean, that is disgusting and there were some comments about the facial expressions that I was making behind Sussan Ley when she made that 90 second statement highlighting that to the Australian people. And that was because I was absolutely disgusted at the name of that band, which I’m not going to repeat, because it makes me feel ill. And so, there’s no way that the Prime Minister wouldn’t have known what that t-shirt meant to Jewish Australians. I’ll say no more.

ANDREW CLENNELL:

Angie Bell, thank you.

ENDS.